New Haven Independent

Posted by: Name Withheld | April 30, 2008 5:30 PM

Speeders and red-light runners are a far, far more serious threat to neighborhood safety, because they are much more likely to cause severe injury and death. Anyone traveling even 1MPH in excess of the speed limit, or running a light, should be given a $1,000 fine.

Also, some of the people speeding through this neighborhood are criminals. Cracking down on traffic violations is a more effective way of cutting down on crime than random police patrols can ever be. Not respecting the speed limit, and putting other people's lives in jeopardy as a result, is a good predictor of other antisocial behaviors.

Posted by: Esbe | April 30, 2008 5:37 PM

If this kind of crime continues, it might just destroy a city neighborhood, if not the economic basis of the entire town. Home owners will put up with many urban inconveniences, even some risk of property crime, but no one with the economic means of moving to the suburbs will accept a serious risk of this kind of crime. (And morally, no one without such economic means ought to have to put up such a threat, either.)

It is even worse when the city says "and please don't think that having a home alarm will help."

Luckily, one of the cretins involved was caught, which may at least break up this particular little gang.

Posted by: In The Hood | April 30, 2008 5:43 PM

When I first read this s. My first reaction was concerned for the safety and well being of ALL law abiding residents of New Haven.

Then, I immediately became concerned about the apparent value placed on one segment of our society over others; and the overly simplistic manner in which the media and affluent East Rock Residents alike might compare and contrast Newhallville to East Rock.

Unfortunately, thanks Mellissa for confirming my suspicions.
g-

Posted by: East Rock Resident | April 30, 2008 5:56 PM

People need to realize they need to watch out for and stick up for themselves. Counting on the police only helps after the incident has taken place.

One day these types of dirtbags will make the mistake of picking the wrong house to enter.

That will be a fine day.

Posted by: Elfer | April 30, 2008 6:10 PM

We in the East Rock neighborhood have got to get serious and protect ourselves. Were being violated by criminals and left vulnerable by the City. Before this City is turned over to the thugs we must make a stand and take each part back as a community. Leave the excuses to the City officials and let's get to work about what we value.

Posted by: mr. october | April 30, 2008 6:26 PM

These criminals deserve at least 40 years in jail, regardless of age. I'd like to see Barbara Fair and Norm Pattis' defense of these criminals, or at least why they shouldn't be put in a very bad place for a very long time.
Had they killed someone, they would deserve the death penalty. And by the way, the death penalty is not a deterrent, but a way to deal with the most heanous of crimes in a manner according the the wishes of the majority of the population.

Posted by: abg | April 30, 2008 6:27 PM

a good block watch is at least as important as alarm systems

Posted by: robn | April 30, 2008 7:39 PM

Homeowners AREN'T going to put up with this. The NHPD best catch the others...then throw the book at them...lest they see a repeat of the edgewood armed patrols in East Rock.

Posted by: armijos | April 30, 2008 9:09 PM

ESBE
I reread the article but couldn't find where you quoted what "the city says" from.

Posted by: robn | May 1, 2008 8:57 AM

ITH,

This isn't a street crime, a mugging or robbery, its a violent home invasion. Its a reprehensible situation iff people can't be safe inside of their home (ANYWHERE IN NEW HAVEN).

Posted by: Devin | May 1, 2008 10:52 AM

This is terrible, what can we do???

Preventing these sorts of crimes in East Rock will benefit the city as a whole.

Posted by: jackie | May 1, 2008 11:37 AM

Woah, ITH -- what are you talking about? We hear about violent crimes from other parts of the city all the time in this forum and in others. (In fact, that seems to be *all* we hear about.)

Besides--part of what makes something newsworthy is its unusualness. Home invasions of this sort are apparently unusual, especially in that part of town.

Posted by: jackie | May 1, 2008 11:39 AM

ps--isn't it great that the YALE PD tracked down the stolen car?

boy, that institution just doesn't contribute at all to this city, does it?

Posted by: Paul Wessel | May 1, 2008 12:21 PM

I live in East Rock. It's awful that this happened - and it would have been awful in whatever neighborhood it occurred.

We should all be vigilant, watch out for ourselves and our neighbors, form blockwatches, complain when the police don't come quickly for high priority calls, etc. This attack remind us of that.

My sense is, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong, that there is no spike in crimes in East Rock. That is, I am not aware that it is any more dangerous living in East Rock in May of 2008, than it was in May of 2007 or 2006.

I am most impressed that the cops caught the guys - or at least one of them - so quickly. It's heartening that the Yale-paid Yale police cooperated with the New Haven police on finding the car and aprehending at least one suspect. It seems like a good collaborative use of my property tax dollars and Yale's endowment returns. Kudos to the officers involved.

Posted by: Ned | May 1, 2008 2:53 PM

"My sense is, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong, that there is no spike in crimes in East Rock." In case of crime, perception is as important as numbers - would anyone feel better if there were only one armed robbery, rape, random assault vs. two?; one violent burglary vs. none? If one doesn't feel safe going to the park, sitting on one's porch, or going for an evening stroll, then numbers are not going to sway anyone. Also, keep in mind that many crimes, e.g. stolen bicycles, vandalism and threatening behaviors, etc. go unreported - to the police, but not necessarily among neighbors. In neighborhoods with more transient populations, creating a block watch is not possible and knowing who "belongs" in the neighborhood seems more of a guess, as people are constantly moving in and out, leaving only a legacy of junk on the curb. I wouldn't rely on the police or the strangers next door for protection.

Posted by: Cordalie | May 1, 2008 7:08 PM

I know that first comment sounds like I wrote it. In fact I think I have said the exact same thing at almost every Management Team Meeting I have attended, but please understand I always sign my own name. I am very sorry for the victim here and am very impressed that the police apprehended at least one perp. PS who is quoating me?

Posted by: Kimberly Charlotte Franklin | May 1, 2008 7:42 PM

This is not an issue of the inequality of law enforcement between two neighborhoods. This is an issue indicating the breakdown of society. The police are, of necessity a reactive, not a proactive organization. I do not believe that we would want the police department arresting people for crimes they might, possibly, at come future time commit. Additionally, the police cannot be everywhere. At some level, we are going to be forced to assume the responsibility for our own safety and defense against criminals. The answer to the problem of protecting ourselves against violent criminals is for us to exercise our Second Amendment rights. Unfortunately, the only thing some members of our society understand is force. When criminals contemplating a home invasion realize that an armed and prepared homeowner may well meet them on the other side of the door they are about to break down, they are probably going to decide that the potential gain is not worth the risk of being shot dead.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | May 1, 2008 9:39 PM

OHHHHH NED...Very well said!!! And Very RIGHT! The people get tired of calling in and getting no help. So what does that do it make a person that is aggravated about a crime even more aggravated! It is less stressful to not call. Which I am sure is a good thing for the city when it comes to numbers!
Then people wonder why I am so PRO 3 strikes THIS IS WHY!!!! What kind of time do you think this kid is going to do?? A year maybe 2 tops after he gets sentence to 10 year but in the end only does 6 months!!
This woman has 2 broken arms and stples across her head...not to mention the life time of fear this has created for her!!!!

mr. october
hehehe so true.

But Bfair argument would be this happens every day in the city. Which is true.

Posted by: Fedupwithliberals | May 1, 2008 10:03 PM

Truly amazing how all news agencies involved in this story will not say what the race of the perpetrators were. Had this been white thugs breaking into a black family's house and beating the occupants senseless, it would have been splashed across all media outlets in full detail with clergy and activists screaming "hate crime". What is the difference here? Why is this not reaching the level of similar speculation? If you really want to be PC, don't even mention the sex of the criminals!

Posted by: East Rockette | May 1, 2008 11:56 PM

Do the police know if this was a random target, or if these kids had been staking out this particular house? I don't know if that matters; I guess I just want to feel that neighborhood watch can make a difference. But who's looking out at 11 at night?

Like CedarHillResident, I'm upset for the victim, and like Ned I agree that perception is at least as important as data, when it comes to violent crime. This incident makes me feel ill at ease in a way I haven't since moving to New Haven. What goes through the mind of a 17 year old - assuming he's not a total sociopath - when he takes a baseball bat to someone who could be his mother or his grandmother? For what, ice cream and a computer? What the hell??

Posted by: Esbe | May 2, 2008 11:39 AM

Elfer -- you are right that the article doesn't explain my comment, but it does reference another East Rock resident who believes that the police were slow to respond to a middle of the night burglar alarm. What the article doesn't mention is that when that resident called the police -- with the alarm blaring in the background, fearful of a home invasion -- she was told that the police were busy with a killing elsewhere in the city and couldn't respond to every burglar alarm. It turns out that when the alarm company itself called police, the police did show up, I think about 25 minutes later. (And it turned out to be a false alarm.)

Posted by: brian | May 2, 2008 12:54 PM

what occurred on loomis place was a terrible tragedy. thanks to the outstanding work by the NHPD and the YPD, one of the perpetrators was apprehended and a confession was obtained. valuable property and evidence was also apparently recovered as well. i'm sure any and all leads are being followed up so as to identify and apprehend the remaining suspects. the victim herself must also be considered a hero by the way she responded to the attack and held up for investigators throughout the ordeal. my thoughts and prayers go out to her.

it's tiring to hear the same stories over and over about police response time and availability of officers, but unfortunately in an urban setting like new haven it's a reality. the establishment of cooperative efforts on the part of neighborhoods such as blockwatch are invaluable. it's also so important for residents to report any and all crime, no matter how frustrating. when individuals find areas to commit crimes with relative ease, they'll often return. allocation of police personnel are also based in part on reported crime. we as residents must do everything possible to deter these activities. as is often said, if you see something, say something. be safe.

Posted by: 2nd Amendment | May 2, 2008 4:21 PM

Time to take a firearms safety course, purchase a handgun and learn to use it. Maybe these thugs would "think" before acting. In brief, keep 'em guessing...

Posted by: Jack in the box | May 2, 2008 4:47 PM

Why no story about how the State police recently pulled out of New Haven?

Newhallville, right below E.Rock, is a hotbed of violence and gang activity right now. Perhaps E.Rockers should edcuate themselves about what's happening in one of N.Haven's toughest neighborhoods.

One of the two cops who work that beat said "it's pretty similar to Bagdad- all chaos." Why doesn't the Independent interview them?

Posted by: Edward_H | May 2, 2008 7:31 PM

I hope this compels those who do have burglar alarms to use them religously. A blaring alarm puts intense phsychological pressure on a criminal to get out of the area quickly. Besides the criminal who breaks into your home can only beat you in the head with a baseball bat for 18 minutes rather than a few hours.

We have groups in New Haven protesting everything from police searching cracks for crack to what certain restaurants are serving on their menus. Is there any group of people protesting the continued victimization of law abiding tax paying citizens by career criminals and young savages?

And dont even think of defending yourself in New Haven or you might end up arrested

http://www.newhavenindependent.org/archives/2007/06/he_wasnt_taking.php

Posted by: Chris Gray | May 3, 2008 3:00 AM

FedUpWithLiberals does have a small point. Issues of race have become exceedingly difficult to discuss, especially this election season.

I saw Alfreda Edwards on Channel 8 News tonight having a hard time expressing the odd conflict of representing the two starkly different constituencies in her ward. She tried a "two sides of the street" line, gave up and said something like, "well, we're all in danger" if such crimes happen.

She's correct. Criminals using race as a motive in one crime might just as easily use some other issue as a motive (such as relative apparent wealth or a long forgotten slight) in another.

Still, we need to find a way to discuss it without hemming and hawing.

In the late '80s I was badly beaten by two young men, though one aggressively and the other reluctantly. By the next day my injuries were obvious but I had also drawn a cartoon of the attack (where, as in real life, the reluctant boy complained to his partner, "He's wearing an apartheid t-shirt", meaning an anti-apartheid t-shirt). Still, every white person who asked me about it and was shown the cartoon then asked, "Were they black?"

My incredulous answer to each was, "I've been beaten by whites, by blacks and by yellows," (all true and often in pairs) "and I've never seen any difference in the scars they left." I was never really concerned with their motives.

Of course, I'm lucky to still have my scalp.

Posted by: cedarhillresident | May 3, 2008 9:14 AM

Jack in the box
I love ya..........we in Cedar Hill have a spike in dealing to. We have given a heads up on the 7 house in a one block area that are dealing. As I stated earlier this happens everyday around the city. Newhallville, East Rock and Cedar Hill cops are one in the same. The patrol all of it. That is why we all need to get together and demand more officers for this area or demand the divide the area into 2 like the have suggested in the past!!

Posted by: Jack in the box | May 3, 2008 11:37 AM

The occupants of the best neighborhoods (esp the upper part of e.rock)seem to think there's an invisible barrier between them and the gang activity and crime happening a few blocks away. Why else spend a million or so on a house in a neighborhood a stone's throw from Newhallville?

The cops have practiced containment for years, but they can't keep it up anymore. At least not in Newhallville.

There are some profound changes in that neighborhood. I wish someone would cover it.

I always look forward to summer, except this year.